GO
Not a breakdown per-say, but does anyone remember the 2014 El Classico that had to have 15 minutes of iPad commentary from the studio because of broadcasting rules? The 5:15 Saturday kickoff put it just in the blackout window.
Watched this in halls at Uni, and none of us could understand what was going on until it came on at 5:30 and I realised it must have been blacked out. Stupid rule, to be honest.
Watched this in halls at Uni, and none of us could understand what was going on until it came on at 5:30 and I realised it must have been blacked out. Stupid rule, to be honest.
BL
Without knowing the precise details, in my experience it looks like the replay vt machine (1”) is having difficulty with its capstan servo - this is the servo controlling the linear tape speed. For whatever reason (damaged tape or an electronic fault?) the linear tape speed has reduced or become ‘hesitant’ and that’s why you can hear the audio ‘wowing’ and appearing to ‘slur’. The machine is trying to re-lock the servo. why does it appear to be out of sync? - the video coming off the replay heads is also hesitant because the linear tape speed is not constant or correct - you could think of it as the vision equivalent of wow and slur, but, the video side of the machine is very clever and even though the video is also being replayed in a mistimed fashion, the replay heads on the vt machine can be deflected to try and compensate for that mistiming. In other words, the mechanical mistiming of the directly replayed video being caused by the servo problem can be partly compensated for by the video heads being deflected to try and overcome that servo mechanical mistiming. There will also be an electronic timebase corrector in the signal chain that is electronically trying to compensate for that too! So, you can see there is lots of processing going on to try and keep that video ‘steady as she goes’. But it can all only do so much! and you can see the video too gets ‘beyond’ hope and there are many video disturbances as the machine is trying its very best as it can to re-lock the capstan servo to keep replaying stable pictures. The audio takes second place in the vt machine’s set of priorities and the vt is happy in itself that if it can the video right then the audio will be right too! That’s why the audio sounds as it does - the vt machine is not interested in it, and will do whatever it needs to do to get the capstan servo to relock properly and get the linear tape speed correct and stable. The human eye is not very sensitive to picture disturbances and you can get away with a lot. The human ear on the other hand is incredibly sensitive to pitch/wow and flutter for example and if any of those parameters ‘goes wrong’ you will become acutely aware of it very very quickly. Just a guess though, based on my own experiences.
I saw an identical fault during Auf Wiedersehen Pet in 1984ish. It was during the closing scene of the programme which had some church bells, they sounded a bit rough, then the closing credits kicked in, the playout just about stumbled over the finishing line. I was watching on TSW, Ian Stirling made a comment to that effect in his, '.. .after the break it's News At Ten.. .' announcement.
1984, so a C Format VTR playout ?
I would presume so. As I think you know, if you have a capstan unlock on a quad machine you wouldn’t get anything sensible picture-wise at all unless you are lucky enough to be replaying off an AVR1 which can replay a tape that has no control track on it at all.
The excellent Neil Miles channel on YouTube has just posted this, where the Keith Harris Show breaks down with a VT fault about 7 minutes in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNhpHrzlLsY
I'm struggling to work out how the sound and pictures got so out of sync on playback of a studio VT recording?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNhpHrzlLsY
I'm struggling to work out how the sound and pictures got so out of sync on playback of a studio VT recording?
Without knowing the precise details, in my experience it looks like the replay vt machine (1”) is having difficulty with its capstan servo - this is the servo controlling the linear tape speed. For whatever reason (damaged tape or an electronic fault?) the linear tape speed has reduced or become ‘hesitant’ and that’s why you can hear the audio ‘wowing’ and appearing to ‘slur’. The machine is trying to re-lock the servo. why does it appear to be out of sync? - the video coming off the replay heads is also hesitant because the linear tape speed is not constant or correct - you could think of it as the vision equivalent of wow and slur, but, the video side of the machine is very clever and even though the video is also being replayed in a mistimed fashion, the replay heads on the vt machine can be deflected to try and compensate for that mistiming. In other words, the mechanical mistiming of the directly replayed video being caused by the servo problem can be partly compensated for by the video heads being deflected to try and overcome that servo mechanical mistiming. There will also be an electronic timebase corrector in the signal chain that is electronically trying to compensate for that too! So, you can see there is lots of processing going on to try and keep that video ‘steady as she goes’. But it can all only do so much! and you can see the video too gets ‘beyond’ hope and there are many video disturbances as the machine is trying its very best as it can to re-lock the capstan servo to keep replaying stable pictures. The audio takes second place in the vt machine’s set of priorities and the vt is happy in itself that if it can the video right then the audio will be right too! That’s why the audio sounds as it does - the vt machine is not interested in it, and will do whatever it needs to do to get the capstan servo to relock properly and get the linear tape speed correct and stable. The human eye is not very sensitive to picture disturbances and you can get away with a lot. The human ear on the other hand is incredibly sensitive to pitch/wow and flutter for example and if any of those parameters ‘goes wrong’ you will become acutely aware of it very very quickly. Just a guess though, based on my own experiences.
I saw an identical fault during Auf Wiedersehen Pet in 1984ish. It was during the closing scene of the programme which had some church bells, they sounded a bit rough, then the closing credits kicked in, the playout just about stumbled over the finishing line. I was watching on TSW, Ian Stirling made a comment to that effect in his, '.. .after the break it's News At Ten.. .' announcement.
1984, so a C Format VTR playout ?
I would presume so. As I think you know, if you have a capstan unlock on a quad machine you wouldn’t get anything sensible picture-wise at all unless you are lucky enough to be replaying off an AVR1 which can replay a tape that has no control track on it at all.
UK
I was going to mention this one if nobody else did. The impending storm was mentioned at half time (there had already been very heavy rain), it was the electrical storm that began during the second half that caused the issues.
I was able to go back and check what happened on this one, it was a much longer outage than I remembered, a shame as it turned into an exciting match:
57 mins: Match falls off air with the score 1-1, 5 live commentary faded up after about 30 seconds during 90 seconds of frozen / broken up picture on BBC 1 before an apology caption appears
60 minutes: Continuity announcer dips commentary to apologise and tell the audience what they'd worked out
63 minutes: Coverage reappears with just host broadcast graphics, BBC scorebar appears after a couple of minutes
76 mins: Match falls off air again - apology caption and 5 live commentary up after a few seconds of frozen / broken picture
79 mins: Germany score to make it 2-1, BBC viewers hear the 5 Live commentary but don't see pictures
80 mins: Picture return to see final replays of goal being celebrated- but not the goal itself, 5 Live commentary continues
81 mins: 5 Live audio briefly replaced by clean stadium FX, pictures continue but no BBC graphics- just lower thirds from the host broadcaster
86 mins: Turkey score to make it 2-2, lots of countries apparently missed this, BBC viewers see it with 5 live commentary
87 mins: BBC score graphic and TV commentary returned
89 mins: Germany score to go 3-2 ahead
90 mins: Pictures lost again (in the same way) as replays of the goal are being shown. BBC switch to host broadcaster pictures and (reserve feed of?) TV commentary. This is kept through injury time until the end of the game.
John Morton and Mark Lawrenson filled at the end of the game and apologised for the lack of picture- sounding as if they were unaware viewers currently had them. Gary Lineker picked up after a couple of minutes but had to talk over the word feed, saying they couldn't come back to the studio pictures at present. They were able to return to the studio about 6 minutes after the match had ended. There were limited replays available but they had at least one angle of each goal to talk over.They were able to go to a unilateral standup from Ray Stubs pitch side in Basel, and a brief report from a very wet Jake Humphrey in Vienna on how the fan park had been evacuated.
The story that went around at the time was that both the BBC main and reserve feeds went through the IBC, so when that lost power the BBC were in trouble, as were most broadcasters. Apparently there was an EBU reserve that was uplinked directly from the ground - so countries who took that could carry on with coverage. (I remember reading some suggestion that UEFA only wanted broadcasters taking pictures via the IBC, I've no idea if thats true.) That reserve was apparently being downlinked by (then Siemens run?) sat ops at TVC and passed on to ITV for their highlights (ITV also had a direct ISDN with commentary on), however those reserve pictures hadn't been booked through to BBC 1 playout. Presumably it was then hurriedly booked and rooted through to BBC One by 80 minutes and that (later with some kind of reserve of the TV commentary) is what was used when the feed went again and from 80 minutes onwards it was used quite a lot.
I seem to remember reading that Al Jazeera were taking coverage using ITVs commentary so kept pictures with minimal interruption as they had the EBU reserve available, as did presumably the Swiss, but not ZDF. I'm guessing that most broadcasters assumed (or had no other option than to rely on) a well speced IBC having reserve power (or quick start generators?) if the main supply was lost?
One of the most spectacular ones I've seen was during Euro 2008 - a storm played havoc with coverage of the Germany v Turkey semi-final. I watched it in a bar in Munich and saw both the storm and the broadcast cut out!
Coverage fell off the air (cue mayhem in the bar as people ran to see if it was on in other bars), then ZDF put on audio commentary before finally patching through Swiss coverage. If I remember rightly, the Swiss coverage came on ZDF just in time for a German goal. I believe the BBC had to wait much longer to get pictures back.
Coverage fell off the air (cue mayhem in the bar as people ran to see if it was on in other bars), then ZDF put on audio commentary before finally patching through Swiss coverage. If I remember rightly, the Swiss coverage came on ZDF just in time for a German goal. I believe the BBC had to wait much longer to get pictures back.
I was going to mention this one if nobody else did. The impending storm was mentioned at half time (there had already been very heavy rain), it was the electrical storm that began during the second half that caused the issues.
I was able to go back and check what happened on this one, it was a much longer outage than I remembered, a shame as it turned into an exciting match:
57 mins: Match falls off air with the score 1-1, 5 live commentary faded up after about 30 seconds during 90 seconds of frozen / broken up picture on BBC 1 before an apology caption appears
60 minutes: Continuity announcer dips commentary to apologise and tell the audience what they'd worked out
63 minutes: Coverage reappears with just host broadcast graphics, BBC scorebar appears after a couple of minutes
76 mins: Match falls off air again - apology caption and 5 live commentary up after a few seconds of frozen / broken picture
79 mins: Germany score to make it 2-1, BBC viewers hear the 5 Live commentary but don't see pictures
80 mins: Picture return to see final replays of goal being celebrated- but not the goal itself, 5 Live commentary continues
81 mins: 5 Live audio briefly replaced by clean stadium FX, pictures continue but no BBC graphics- just lower thirds from the host broadcaster
86 mins: Turkey score to make it 2-2, lots of countries apparently missed this, BBC viewers see it with 5 live commentary
87 mins: BBC score graphic and TV commentary returned
89 mins: Germany score to go 3-2 ahead
90 mins: Pictures lost again (in the same way) as replays of the goal are being shown. BBC switch to host broadcaster pictures and (reserve feed of?) TV commentary. This is kept through injury time until the end of the game.
John Morton and Mark Lawrenson filled at the end of the game and apologised for the lack of picture- sounding as if they were unaware viewers currently had them. Gary Lineker picked up after a couple of minutes but had to talk over the word feed, saying they couldn't come back to the studio pictures at present. They were able to return to the studio about 6 minutes after the match had ended. There were limited replays available but they had at least one angle of each goal to talk over.They were able to go to a unilateral standup from Ray Stubs pitch side in Basel, and a brief report from a very wet Jake Humphrey in Vienna on how the fan park had been evacuated.
The story that went around at the time was that both the BBC main and reserve feeds went through the IBC, so when that lost power the BBC were in trouble, as were most broadcasters. Apparently there was an EBU reserve that was uplinked directly from the ground - so countries who took that could carry on with coverage. (I remember reading some suggestion that UEFA only wanted broadcasters taking pictures via the IBC, I've no idea if thats true.) That reserve was apparently being downlinked by (then Siemens run?) sat ops at TVC and passed on to ITV for their highlights (ITV also had a direct ISDN with commentary on), however those reserve pictures hadn't been booked through to BBC 1 playout. Presumably it was then hurriedly booked and rooted through to BBC One by 80 minutes and that (later with some kind of reserve of the TV commentary) is what was used when the feed went again and from 80 minutes onwards it was used quite a lot.
I seem to remember reading that Al Jazeera were taking coverage using ITVs commentary so kept pictures with minimal interruption as they had the EBU reserve available, as did presumably the Swiss, but not ZDF. I'm guessing that most broadcasters assumed (or had no other option than to rely on) a well speced IBC having reserve power (or quick start generators?) if the main supply was lost?
Last edited by UKnews on 1 May 2018 5:08pm - 7 times in total
MA
mannewskev
I remember when the big breakfast went off air for about half an hour. Channel 4 filled with The Clangers of all things and then ITN did an extended big breakfast news, which is impressive given they cant have had much in the way of resources to do that.
I remember them going off for quite a long time and them showing an episode of The Banana Splits, and when they came back, Chris claimed that a garden gnome had pulled out one of the plugs in the house.
Because I was obsessed with The Big Breakfast at the start I vividly remember both of those. The latter was on St Patrick's Day 1993, which I remember because when they came back, they cut to a plug socket with a leprechaun doll they'd been playing around with all morning next to it. It was off for about ten minutes and I remember when they did the phone-in competition later, Chris asked one of the callers what C4 had done while they were away and the caller said "they played some awful music".
The former was in 1995, when Gaby and Mark were presenting. I remember at 7am they went to the news and then couldn't get back from it, and Peter Smith stayed on screen - I can remember him repeating stuff he was being fed down his earpiece. Then it went back to C4 continuity, flitting between standby stuff like The Clangers, old clips and the news. I remember listening to Chris Evans on Radio 1 during it and he said people were phoning up to say they were showing clips of him. Then as you say, there was an extended news bulletin with full reports, presumably taken off the Morning News or something, before they finally went back to the house at about five to eight. Went on for ages.
Isn't there another breakdown with Gaby and Keith where Gaby says something like "You never know when we might go away again" and they go off air again shortly after or was that the same one with Mark?
I think this is the same breakdown, but was actually with Gaby and Keith, while Mark was on one of his extended stints away in 1995.
WH
Whataday
Founding member
There was a curious breakdown on The Big Breakfast in 1992 which I believe is on Private Parts. Gaby throws to a Dennis cartoon, and the second they cut to it the picture goes wobbly, clock and all. They cut to a breakdown slide which was a shot of the cereal box they used at launch, and eventually they returned in time to catch the end of Dennis. It was bizarre how playing out the cartoon seemed to cause the disruption and they couldn't just cut back away from it.
CO
Regarding the Germany v Turkey match, it was the Swiss who had a feed from the stadium, not via the IBC.
The BBC would have backed up a home nations team with a basic uplink.
I have done that role on occasions, for example from South Africa in 2010, when the BBC crew (of 9 plus a local driver) following the England team had a hire truck with a derig kit in, including a Upod satellite dish and a then fairly rare HD encoder, with a SD backup one.
We had a feed of the match from the on site MCR, as well as our own two cameras.
Primarily to supply BBC unilaterals from the stadium, we would have backed up the main feed if the IBC had issues.
However, restrictions of space on site leads to only the rights holders for those teams featured usually having access to those facilities.
The BBC would have backed up a home nations team with a basic uplink.
I have done that role on occasions, for example from South Africa in 2010, when the BBC crew (of 9 plus a local driver) following the England team had a hire truck with a derig kit in, including a Upod satellite dish and a then fairly rare HD encoder, with a SD backup one.
We had a feed of the match from the on site MCR, as well as our own two cameras.
Primarily to supply BBC unilaterals from the stadium, we would have backed up the main feed if the IBC had issues.
However, restrictions of space on site leads to only the rights holders for those teams featured usually having access to those facilities.
RO
When TV-Ark returns, it hopefully will have, once again, the breakdown, or cock up, on the nine o clock news from 1995. It was after John Major held off a Tory leadership challenge from John Redwood. The clip started with John Seargent doing a piece to camera, then going to a VT of the outside of parliament, with the audio from committee room 13, where the announcement was made. Just after the result is announced on the tape, it suddenly goes into rewind!
It then goes black after several seconds. If you have headphones, you were able to clearly hear this, but even if you didn't, put your ear to the laptop speakers, and you can just make out someone saying "Oops!". They then return to a slightly puzzled Michael Buerk in the studio.
It then goes black after several seconds. If you have headphones, you were able to clearly hear this, but even if you didn't, put your ear to the laptop speakers, and you can just make out someone saying "Oops!". They then return to a slightly puzzled Michael Buerk in the studio.
SW
The Northern regions being played out by Leeds did see the goal, the picture came back about two seconds before it. I remember towards the end the 16:9 picture was squashed into a 4:3 frame.
One thing I remember from that night is that at the end, Martin O'Neill said "I enjoyed that match, what we saw of it", and then Alan Shearer said "Yeah, I enjoyed that match, what we saw of it", as if he thought O'Neill's comment was actually in his head. I think it was the head of ZDF of something who told the press it was "the biggest balls-up of all time".
There was a massive electrical storm during a Germany match in the 1990 World Cup that was being shown live on ITV, and all the commentary boxes were getting evacuated because the rain was getting in all the equipment and breaking it. But Brian Moore and Trevor Francis carried on and by the end were about the only broadcasters still on air.
Oh, it probably was, you know. Turns out I don't vividly remember it that well.
IIRC the Merseyside derby had completely different results depending on which region you were in. Some got it back just in time to see the goal, some didn't get back until the goal was scored. I can't remember off had but it would've been salt in the wound if Granada was one of the latter.
The Northern regions being played out by Leeds did see the goal, the picture came back about two seconds before it. I remember towards the end the 16:9 picture was squashed into a 4:3 frame.
I was going to mention this one if nobody else did. The impending storm was mentioned at half time (there had already been very heavy rain), it was the electrical storm that began during the second half that caused the issues.
One thing I remember from that night is that at the end, Martin O'Neill said "I enjoyed that match, what we saw of it", and then Alan Shearer said "Yeah, I enjoyed that match, what we saw of it", as if he thought O'Neill's comment was actually in his head. I think it was the head of ZDF of something who told the press it was "the biggest balls-up of all time".
There was a massive electrical storm during a Germany match in the 1990 World Cup that was being shown live on ITV, and all the commentary boxes were getting evacuated because the rain was getting in all the equipment and breaking it. But Brian Moore and Trevor Francis carried on and by the end were about the only broadcasters still on air.
I think this is the same breakdown, but was actually with Gaby and Keith, while Mark was on one of his extended stints away in 1995.
Oh, it probably was, you know. Turns out I don't vividly remember it that well.
SP
Then this one where the Warren Beatty film "Heaven Can Wait" fails to make it to air and pres clearly either don't have a backup copy or are having problems with the backup as well as they give up on showing it altogether before going to the standby film "Timescape"
http://dai.ly/x43wwt7
Interestingly, BBC Wales's version of that breakdown is also available
However I think the film Heaven Can Wait must be cursed - BBC Wales lost their network feed during a previous showing in 1992 and didn't manage to get it back, with the announcer having to do a slightly embarrassed apology after half an of slide and music. (File 13357 if you have access to the MHP PP)
Then this one where the Warren Beatty film "Heaven Can Wait" fails to make it to air and pres clearly either don't have a backup copy or are having problems with the backup as well as they give up on showing it altogether before going to the standby film "Timescape"
http://dai.ly/x43wwt7
Interestingly, BBC Wales's version of that breakdown is also available
However I think the film Heaven Can Wait must be cursed - BBC Wales lost their network feed during a previous showing in 1992 and didn't manage to get it back, with the announcer having to do a slightly embarrassed apology after half an of slide and music. (File 13357 if you have access to the MHP PP)
IS
I seem to remember that Al Jazeera Sport was the only other broadcaster that didn't lose the match and, at the time at least, no one knew how or where they were getting it from
But wasn't part of the issue the weather affecting the uplinks?
Regarding the Germany v Turkey match, it was the Swiss who had a feed from the stadium, not via the IBC.
I seem to remember that Al Jazeera Sport was the only other broadcaster that didn't lose the match and, at the time at least, no one knew how or where they were getting it from
Quote:
The BBC would have backed up a home nations team with a basic uplink.
But wasn't part of the issue the weather affecting the uplinks?